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Talk:Plotholes in the .hack series
Formatting of the page Rather than list it by series, it's best to list it by topic. The only one that came to mind was the first fight between Haseo and Azure Kite. I forget the details but I know it had something to do with Saburou being a witness and Haseo going to see Tabby. Kulaguy 02:12, 29 September 2007 (UTC) :How is that a plothole? We don't see her, but she was hiding... - Kuukai2 02:39, 29 September 2007 (UTC) ::Did you not read what I said? I forgot the details. Hell, I haven't even watched Roots. Go ask someone who has. Kulaguy 03:10, 29 September 2007 (UTC) :::I don't recall it very well, but I do remember thinking "WTF?! How does this fit?" while watching that episode briefly. --Rpg 03:15, 29 September 2007 (UTC) :::I was talking to anyone who knew. I think we should figure this out before we deem it a plothole. Things like Azure Kite kicking and Saburo not being seen are really just aesthetic, not sure about the Tabby thing though. - Kuukai2 03:21, 29 September 2007 (UTC) ::::Things like Haseo vanishing completely upon being Data Drained, however... --Shinsou Wotan 03:33, 29 September 2007 (UTC) HAHA THIS IS THE BEST PAGE EVER! GU frustrated me in so many ways, I'll be happy to think for a bit and add some topics for this. --Rpg 02:14, 29 September 2007 (UTC) Cubia and Anti-Existence Maybe I just wasn't understanding it right...but here's an issue I had. In IMOQ, Aura warned that destroying Cubia would unmake the bracelet. Kite of course, reversed this, and sacrificed the bracelet to off Cubia. Then there's GU Cubia. They said that They couldn't simply sacrifice the epitaph users to destroy Cubia since OVan had already been destroyed, but wouldn't that mean they were already 1/8 of the way there? Then, they actually beat Cubia. Shouldn't that have destroyed the Epitaph users in turn as well? --Rpg 03:19, 29 September 2007 (UTC) :I don't remember exactly, but I thought all she said was that to destroy Cubia was to destroy the bracelet. This is what I remember from the Japanese version at least, and her conversation in G.U. seems to support this as the only way she knows of to kill it. Also, she said Ovan was "lost", not destroyed, so he was floating around somewhere existing and screwing the whole thing up. Lastly, they beat Cubia with unexplained Ovan deus ex machina magic, so logic doesn't need to work... ::<_< I'd say Deus ex machina magic doesn't justify it. If anything, it just proves that they didn't think that little detail all the way through. --Rpg 03:38, 29 September 2007 (UTC) :::Or it means they wanted to keep it open to interpretation. Maybe he just "reset the balance" on the Key, like when Kite got a new bracelet. It's not unexplainable, just unexplained, so it's not a plothole as I understand it. Lots of things in .hack are like this. "Maybe" is used all over the place in analysis to suggest what was happening without confirming it, so as to leave it open for fans to speculate. - Kuukai2 04:06, 29 September 2007 (UTC) Rebirth: First Fight Vs. Last Fight Azure Kite is at an unknown level at the beginning of the game, but, going by GameShark at least, his level is around Haseo's at the end. Since Ovan walks in at the end of the first fight, and AK+Ovan = Dead AK, it's enirely possible Kite had to start from scratch just like Haseo. Also take into account that Haseo had a party the second time, and that they didn't kill AK's PC at all, he just changed his strategy. In addition, pre-game Haseo's a level boost may or may not have affected his stats, and he was using the crappiest weapons possible. Skeith might also affect his PC's effectiveness against crazy stuff like Kite, which may be the reason Ovan always fought him before summoning Corbenik, What I'm trying to say is that it has explanations. - Kuukai2 23:41, 29 September 2007 (UTC) :Azure Kite defeated Haseo the first time because Haseo was a target for Azure Kite. At the end of Rebirth, Kite was ignoring Haseo and trying to get to the lockers. Not a plothole. Kulaguy 00:04, 30 September 2007 (UTC) Then way didn't push Haseo aside? I get the feeling he could have done that at lest if he wanted to... Besides, even if that where the case, if he was not run (err, float) away and ignor the battle compleatly? Whyed he even attack. Also there's only so much blocking can do, if he really was that weak, the all Haseo had to do is push down the X button, and preform a gaurd brake or an art... (but thats looking at from a game perspective. And there's the fact Haseo could have been in a blind rage then.) And what about the second battle with Kite, he was deffinetly giving his all on that one, plot wise at least... --Pancake 00:23, 30 September 2007 (UTC) :He didn't shove Haseo away because he felt that Haseo wasn't a threat. And please, answer me this. If you're trying to go from Point A to Point B and there are several 7 year olds bothering you, what would you do? Obviously you'd ignore them first, but once they got to you, you'd fight back (assuming nobody else was watching). That's the way I see it. And which battle is the "second battle" to you? The one during Redemption? And I have more to add. The whole "LAWLZ HASEO BEAT HIM AT 50 AND FAILED AT 133" is a kind of symbolic kinda thing. Haseo failed the first time because he believed he could do everything alone. The second time around, he had friends to help. It's to kinda show that you can do anything if you have friends to support you. To me, I ignore levels and stats because they contradict pretty much everything in the series. I mean, hey, look at Tabby. She gets her Gauntlets at a very early level in Roots and equips them, but when you get her in Redemption, they're level 116. Kulaguy 01:14, 30 September 2007 (UTC) Quick Question, sorry ;_; Hi, I made an edit concerning the color-change to Shino's hair in-game vs the anime, but when I came back, I think my edit got deleted o_O; Was my post really that irrelevant? Or was it just merged with the previous sentance? I'm confused...Sorry my edit wasn't much help.. MizuTakishima 07:32, February 11, 2010 (UTC)MizuTakishima :I think your edit was pretty much covered already by the Azure Kite and Haseo section.--OtakuD50 08:12, February 11, 2010 (UTC) ::It already says it's because of aesthetic differences. No need to say the same thing again. Kulaguy 03:50, February 12, 2010 (UTC) Wouldn't Symbolic and Aesthetic be two different things? I know it mentions something symbolic in Haseo's mind, but that doesn't really talk about the symbolism in anime in general. Again sorry for the idiotic questions MizuTakishima 04:03, February 12, 2010 (UTC)MizuTakishima :Symbolic? What's so symbolic about hair and eye color change? It's only aesthetic differences. Give a legitimate reason as to what it could symbolize. Kulaguy 04:14, February 12, 2010 (UTC) Oh. My Bad, I thought everyone knew. Well, you see, you know how in some manga, and video games, certain characters have their hair color or eyes colors changed once they appear in an anime? It's not because of Aesthetics, it's because of Symbolism. (There are obviously acceptions of course) Certain character archetypes have particular...colors assigned to them, if you will. For example, purple eyes can mean royalty; and if the character isn't a royal, then sometimes, for the anime, they'll change that eye color to something else, like blue, brown, maybe even gold. (Just about any eye color is symbolic really, though I wish I had a list of it..I'm sure there's one posted online somewhere) The same thing can be said about character hair colors. (Unless...eyes are the only thing with symbolic significance. I'm not entirely sure on what the Japanese culture says about hair color, other than having "orange hair" means you're trying to stand out, and that blonde hair makes you "easy") Oh. Wow. I found something just now and I was fairly close...-ish. See if these links are the least bit helpful: Symbolic colors anime hair color I know those links may not be the best sources in the world, but I've seen people talk about hair/eye colors being symbolic in other fandoms as well, so..maybe it has some merit? Sorry if my post is long or a waste of time :( MizuTakishima 09:31, February 12, 2010 (UTC)MizuTakishima :Yes, things can be symbolic, but not every anime port uses a chart to make them that way. Mangas are black and white, so color really isn't much of an issue. in anime however, it is necisary to get it right. Most of the time, the character designer makes both the person and their appearance at the same time, thus a upbeat person gets an upbeat look. It's not nesisarily symbolism unless the creators say it is. GU had Shino maintain her appearance to satisfy a non-obsessed audiance. It would be confussing for an audiance who didn't watch roots to have a third shino to keep up with. This carries over to the anime aswell. Roots was primerally made for a anime-only audiance (the same pricks who only satched hack/sign and DUSK) so they made anime desisions. see the appearance of Negimaru. The games had their workable avatar(not phase), the manga had a version requireing less need for explanation, and the anime had something that looked wierd, but didn't need his character as fleshed out to understand his motives to making such a loser avatar and thus was given some stature. The easiest and least stereotypical way to go about aesthetics/symbolism is to simply look at the character and jot down the feelings that it invokes in you. As for the hair color change in general, the pink hair would look nasty in the game where it looks nice in the anime. --Falcon At 14:45, February 12, 2010 (UTC) ::I just realized that the section already mentions symbolism. :::DUSK ::Fail. :::the pink hair would look nasty in the game ::Pi would like to have a word with you. Kulaguy 23:08, February 13, 2010 (UTC) ::::DUSK-- I was being ironic, stating I hated when people call it hack/sign and DUSK. You can't fail me. pink=nasty Pi's hair is a competely different pink. Shinos was a low saturation pink that wouldn't fit well in the high saturation scenes of the games. I know my soapbox.--Falcon At 02:40, February 14, 2010 (UTC) I'm a little confused on the subject, but why not just leave it as Aesthetics? Shino's hair changes color all the time, books, manga, game, you name it and at some point it was different. Nothing too symbolic... (might just be to keep separate from Atoli) Also which scene was this? Outlaw630 18:31, February 12, 2010 (UTC)